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Re: Response: Now with 1x more *GIF*
By:Cody Miller
Date: 3/20/14 8:21 pm
In Response To: Response: Now with 1x more *GIF* (Grizzlei)

: All of these traits characterize an ideal person and don't take into
: consideration those who can't obtain them or even want to. Like those
: skills mentioned "out of the box" in the image you provided,
: they need to be held with equal regard without any expectation or stigma.

I guess this is where we disagree. I reject the notion that I hold in equal regard someone who is manipulated by others, and someone who makes his own choices. One is clearly a better thing to be.

: There's no difference to either of the differences you think there's a
: difference to.

There is a huge difference. For instance, all boxers are pretty strong. They are not weak. Some are however, weaker than their competitors, otherwise every bout would end in a tie. So saying someone is weaker than someone else does not mean they are objectively weak.

: Oh, the "gay best friend" stereotype? How cute.

I speak from what I see. The point was that being liked by women is a positive, regardless of your orientation or sex. A straight woman liked by other women is a positive. An asexual man liked by women is a positive. It does not necessarily imply heteronormativity.

: A boy who's ridiculed daily for his short height by his taller peers can't
: just simply adopt a bunch of inches to his height.

Correct, which is why in my first post I specifically discount tall and short from the discussion.

: Undesirable to whom? I enjoy expressing my femininity and have little care
: for what others think of me because of it.

Which aspects of your femininity do you enjoy expressing? Not all traits seen as feminine are undesirable. For instance, nurturing is seen as a feminine trait (whereas protection is seen as masculine), however that is clearly not something any man should want to avoid being.

: Which of those traits would you consider to be the healthiest and what
: lifestyle would you insist they adopt to achieve them?

Mostly traits dealing with self determination. The ability to create, make decisions, and shape the world the way you want it. Traits that involve concern for the welfare of others.

: Secondly, it is
: those differences between men and women, both societal and biological,
: that have been created and abused over time which have caused the harmful
: connotations of these traits. All of this depends on the individual to
: determine that for themselves. Their happiness and health is not a
: universally written remedy.

Self determination (a trait you endorse above) is generally antithetical to the items outside that box. Even in your view, these traits should be rejected.

: Again, that's the path of your own personality which has dictated the
: lifestyle you wish to pursue. Who are we to insist that all others must
: follow the same? Sure, in our society confidence and decisiveness are
: attractive qualities, but not all people desire it and we shouldn't force
: or expect it from anyone.

Again "the lifestyle you wish to pursue". Traits inside the box make that pursuit possible, and more likely to end in success.

: We should instead embrace everyone regardless of their gender identity and
: whatever personality traits they develop from it or otherwise, and reject
: those who wish to impart strict ideals and traits on others. Each of us
: are unique beings with a vast array of differing qualities and quirks that
: as a whole make us human.

Yes, so I should embrace all those traits outside the box, which clash with even YOUR view of a happy healthy human being?

Messages In This Thread

Gender expectationsCody Miller3/20/14 4:22 am
     Nail. Head. *NM*The Loot3/20/14 4:37 am
     Re: Gender expectationsKal3/20/14 10:24 am
           Re: Gender expectationsXenos3/20/14 11:41 am
                 Re: Gender expectationsKal3/20/14 11:55 am
                       Re: Gender expectationsXenos3/20/14 2:00 pm
           +1Arithmomaniac3/20/14 12:09 pm
     Re: Gender expectationsGrizzlei3/20/14 2:38 pm
           Re: Gender expectationsCody Miller3/20/14 5:30 pm
                 Response: Now with 1x more *GIF*Grizzlei3/20/14 6:24 pm
                       That last paragraphZackDark3/20/14 6:53 pm
                             Re: That last paragraphGrizzlei3/20/14 7:01 pm
                                   Re: That last paragraphZackDark3/20/14 10:18 pm
                       Re: Response: Now with 1x more *GIF*Cody Miller3/20/14 8:21 pm
                             Re: Response: Now with 1x more *GIF*Kal3/20/14 8:30 pm
                                   Re: Response: Now with 1x more *GIF*Cody Miller3/20/14 8:47 pm
                             Re: Response: Now with 1x more *GIF*Grizzlei3/20/14 9:06 pm
                                   Input from the fly on the wallSonofMacPhisto3/21/14 11:20 am
                                         Re: Input from the fly on the wallThe Loot3/22/14 7:46 pm

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