Re: So, we need a topic...Lets try this?

Posted By: Phil (static-64-65-138-250.mspcovdsl.eschelon.com)
Date: 6/2/2003 at 4:45 p.m.

In Response To: Re: So, we need a topic...Lets try this? (Seraph)

Problem with that is, murder is thus a -type- of killing...

Exactly. Murder is a specific type of killing. Killing itself is far more general and ambiguous.

Question, then.
Murder, as defined, is "wrong". What is it about killing in these certain circumstances that gives one the right to kill another?

Good question, and a difficult one to answer. Ultimately, I guess it's the sort of thing that would need to be judged on a case-by-case basis. In a case where a despot is committing crimes against humanity one could argue that the notion of saving numerous other lives gives one the right to kill said despot if necessary. In that case it's a simple matter of numbers. Numerous lives outweigh one life. In the case of the lame horse one would argue that you are ending the horse's suffering, even if you are ending its life. If suffering is wrong, then ending it must be right. This is also the concept behind "assisted suicide."

-Phil.

Messages In This Thread

• hey
  Gothmog (ool-43562621.dyn.optonline.net) -- 5/22/2003 at 9:06 p.m.
  • Re: hey
    Zandervix (cache-rc01.proxy.aol.com) -- 5/22/2003 at 9:49 p.m.
    • Re: hey
      sumone (dial-209-148-113-171.sonic.net) -- 5/24/2003 at 12:39 a.m.
  • Re: hey
    Superfoborg (term1-6.vta.west.net) -- 5/23/2003 at 1:55 a.m.
    • Re: hey
      Gothmog (ool-43562621.dyn.optonline.net) -- 5/23/2003 at 4:14 p.m.
      • So, we need a topic...Lets try this?
        Seraph (adsl-66-120-160-84.dsl.sntc01.pacbell.net) -- 5/24/2003 at 3:15 a.m.
        • Re: So, we need a topic...Lets try this?
          Martel (ppp-189-166.28-151.libero.it) -- 5/24/2003 at 5:09 a.m.
          • Re: So, we need a topic...Lets try this?
            Gothmog (ool-43562621.dyn.optonline.net) -- 5/24/2003 at 5:54 p.m.
            • Re: So, we need a topic...Lets try this?
              Seraph (adsl-66-120-163-45.dsl.sntc01.pacbell.net) -- 5/24/2003 at 7:15 p.m.
              • Re: So, we need a topic...Lets try this?
                Martel (195.110.114.232) -- 5/26/2003 at 12:03 p.m.
                • Re: So, we need a topic...Lets try this?
                  Seraph (adsl-66-120-160-206.dsl.sntc01.pacbell.net) -- 5/26/2003 at 2:32 p.m.
                  • Re: So, we need a topic...Lets try this?
                    Martel (195.110.114.232) -- 5/27/2003 at 4:22 a.m.
              • Re: So, we need a topic...Lets try this?
                Superfoborg (term2-20.vta.west.net) -- 5/27/2003 at 12:24 a.m.
                • Re: So, we need a topic...Lets try this?
                  Seraph (adsl-66-123-200-150.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net) -- 5/27/2003 at 9:18 p.m.
                  • Re: So, we need a topic...Lets try this?
                    Superfoborg (term2-2.vta.west.net) -- 5/28/2003 at 12:00 a.m.
                  • Re: So, we need a topic...Lets try this?
                    Phil (static-64-65-138-250.mspcovdsl.eschelon.com) -- 5/28/2003 at 1:43 p.m.
                    • Re: So, we need a topic...Lets try this?
                      Seraph (adsl-64-171-4-240.dsl.sntc01.pacbell.net) -- 5/28/2003 at 9:35 p.m.
                      • Re: So, we need a topic...Lets try this?
                        Phil (static-64-65-138-250.mspcovdsl.eschelon.com) -- 5/29/2003 at 1:02 p.m.
                        • Re: So, we need a topic...Lets try this?
                          Seraph (adsl-67-122-221-42.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net) -- 5/30/2003 at 1:10 a.m.
                          • Re: So, we need a topic...Lets try this?
                            Doom (207.239.12.200) -- 5/30/2003 at 10:21 a.m.
                            • Re: So, we need a topic...Lets try this?
                              Gothmog (ool-43562621.dyn.optonline.net) -- 5/30/2003 at 3:47 p.m.
                              • Re: So, we need a topic...Lets try this?
                                Phil (static-64-65-138-250.mspcovdsl.eschelon.com) -- 5/30/2003 at 4:02 p.m.
                                • Re: So, we need a topic...Lets try this?
                                  Gothmog (ool-43562621.dyn.optonline.net) -- 6/1/2003 at 9:55 p.m.
                                  • Re: So, we need a topic...Lets try this?
                                    Olorin (host81-134-21-57.in-addr.btopenworld.com) -- 6/2/2003 at 5:19 p.m.
                          • Re: So, we need a topic...Lets try this?
                            Phil (static-64-65-138-250.mspcovdsl.eschelon.com) -- 5/30/2003 at 1:20 p.m.
                            • Re: So, we need a topic...Lets try this?
                              Seraph (adsl-66-126-231-179.dsl.sntc01.pacbell.net) -- 5/31/2003 at 12:36 a.m.
                              • Re: So, we need a topic...Lets try this?
                                Phil (static-64-65-138-250.mspcovdsl.eschelon.com) -- 6/2/2003 at 4:45 p.m.
                            • Re: So, we need a topic...Lets try this? *PIC*
                              Archer »–)› (AST002-2.msns.sm.ptd.net) -- 6/5/2003 at 10:03 p.m.
                              • Re: So, we need a topic...Lets try this?
                                Phil (static-64-65-138-250.mspcovdsl.eschelon.com) -- 6/6/2003 at 3:46 p.m.
                      • Little Shop of Horrors *PIC*
                        Archer »–)› (AST002-2.msns.sm.ptd.net) -- 6/5/2003 at 9:48 p.m.
                    • Re: So, we need a topic...Lets try this? *PIC*
                      Archer »–)› (AST002-2.msns.sm.ptd.net) -- 6/5/2003 at 9:27 p.m.
                      • Re: So, we need a topic...Lets try this?
                        Phil (static-64-65-138-250.mspcovdsl.eschelon.com) -- 6/6/2003 at 1:39 p.m.
                        • Re: So, we need a topic...Lets try this?
                          Olorin (host81-134-4-127.in-addr.btopenworld.com) -- 6/6/2003 at 4:36 p.m.
                          • Re: So, we need a topic...Lets try this?
                            Phil (static-64-65-138-250.mspcovdsl.eschelon.com) -- 6/6/2003 at 6:23 p.m.
                            • Re: So, we need a topic...Lets try this?
                              Olorin (host81-134-4-127.in-addr.btopenworld.com) -- 6/6/2003 at 8:15 p.m.
                  • Re: So, we need a topic...Lets try this? *PIC*
                    Archer »–)› (AST002-2.msns.sm.ptd.net) -- 6/5/2003 at 9:14 p.m.
            • Re: So, we need a topic...Lets try this? *PIC*
              Archer »–)› (AST002-2.msns.sm.ptd.net) -- 6/5/2003 at 8:53 p.m.
              • Re: So, we need a topic...Lets try this?
                Olorin (host81-134-4-127.in-addr.btopenworld.com) -- 6/6/2003 at 8:48 a.m.
        • Re: So, we need a topic...Lets try this?
          Superfoborg (term2-20.vta.west.net) -- 5/27/2003 at 12:11 a.m.
        • Re: So, we need a topic...Lets try this?
          greygelgoog (172.138.134.67) -- 6/1/2003 at 10:31 a.m.
          • Re: So, we need a topic...Lets try this?
            Seraph (adsl-66-120-162-52.dsl.sntc01.pacbell.net) -- 6/1/2003 at 4:24 p.m.
            • Re: So, we need a topic...Lets try this?
              Olorin (host217-36-199-57.in-addr.btopenworld.com) -- 6/1/2003 at 4:47 p.m.
              • Re: So, we need a topic...Lets try this?
                greygelgoog (AC83911C.ipt.aol.com) -- 6/3/2003 at 9:51 a.m.
                • Re: So, we need a topic...Lets try this?
                  Phil (static-64-65-138-250.mspcovdsl.eschelon.com) -- 6/3/2003 at 7:50 p.m.
                  • Re: So, we need a topic...Lets try this?
                    Doom (207.239.12.200) -- 6/4/2003 at 10:42 a.m.
                    • Re: So, we need a topic...Lets try this?
                      Phil (static-64-65-138-250.mspcovdsl.eschelon.com) -- 6/4/2003 at 2:45 p.m.
                      • Re: So, we need a topic...Lets try this? *PIC*
                        Archer »–)› (AST002-2.msns.sm.ptd.net) -- 6/6/2003 at 1:08 a.m.
                        • Re: So, we need a topic...Lets try this?
                          Superfoborg (term1-8.vta.west.net) -- 6/6/2003 at 1:47 a.m.
                        • Re: So, we need a topic...Lets try this?
                          Olorin (host81-134-4-127.in-addr.btopenworld.com) -- 6/6/2003 at 8:55 a.m.
                        • Re: So, we need a topic...Lets try this?
                          Phil (static-64-65-138-250.mspcovdsl.eschelon.com) -- 6/6/2003 at 2:06 p.m.
                          • Re: So, we need a topic...Lets try this? *PIC*
                            Archer »–)› (AST002-2.msns.sm.ptd.net) -- 6/6/2003 at 4:11 p.m.
                            • Re: So, we need a topic...Lets try this?
                              Olorin (host81-134-4-127.in-addr.btopenworld.com) -- 6/6/2003 at 4:32 p.m.
                          • Re: So, we need a topic...Lets try this?
                            Olorin (host81-134-4-127.in-addr.btopenworld.com) -- 6/6/2003 at 4:30 p.m.
                            • Re: So, we need a topic...Lets try this?
                              Phil (static-64-65-138-250.mspcovdsl.eschelon.com) -- 6/6/2003 at 6:00 p.m.
                              • Re: So, we need a topic...Lets try this?
                                Olorin (host81-134-4-127.in-addr.btopenworld.com) -- 6/6/2003 at 8:13 p.m.
                                • Re: So, we need a topic...Lets try this?
                                  Phil (12-225-9-44.client.attbi.com) -- 6/7/2003 at 3:04 a.m.
                    • Re: So, we need a topic...Lets try this?
                      Olorin (host81-134-12-171.in-addr.btopenworld.com) -- 6/4/2003 at 3:24 p.m.
                      • Re: So, we need a topic...Lets try this?
                        Phil (static-64-65-138-250.mspcovdsl.eschelon.com) -- 6/4/2003 at 5:50 p.m.
                        • Re: So, we need a topic...Lets try this?
                          Olorin (host81-134-12-171.in-addr.btopenworld.com) -- 6/4/2003 at 8:26 p.m.
                          • Re: So, we need a topic...Lets try this?
                            Phil (static-64-65-138-250.mspcovdsl.eschelon.com) -- 6/5/2003 at 11:54 a.m.
                            • Re: So, we need a topic...Lets try this?
                              Olorin (host81-134-4-75.in-addr.btopenworld.com) -- 6/5/2003 at 4:40 p.m.
                              • Re: So, we need a topic...Lets try this?
                                Phil (static-64-65-138-250.mspcovdsl.eschelon.com) -- 6/5/2003 at 7:46 p.m.
                          • Re: So, we need a topic...Lets try this? *PIC*
                            Archer »–)› (AST002-2.msns.sm.ptd.net) -- 6/6/2003 at 1:18 a.m.
                  • Re: So, we need a topic...Lets try this?
                    greygelgoog (AC8B159B.ipt.aol.com) -- 6/4/2003 at 2:40 p.m.
                    • Re: So, we need a topic...Lets try this?
                      Phil (static-64-65-138-250.mspcovdsl.eschelon.com) -- 6/4/2003 at 5:08 p.m.
                  • Well said, sir (NT) *NM* *PIC*
                    Archer »–)› (AST002-2.msns.sm.ptd.net) -- 6/6/2003 at 12:53 a.m.
                    • Thanks *NM*
                      Phil (static-64-65-138-250.mspcovdsl.eschelon.com) -- 6/6/2003 at 3:48 p.m.
                • Re: So, we need a topic...Lets try this? *PIC*
                  Archer »–)› (AST002-2.msns.sm.ptd.net) -- 6/6/2003 at 12:23 a.m.
                  • Re: So, we need a topic...Lets try this?
                    Olorin (host81-134-4-127.in-addr.btopenworld.com) -- 6/6/2003 at 9:23 a.m.
                  • Re: So, we need a topic...Lets try this?
                    Phil (static-64-65-138-250.mspcovdsl.eschelon.com) -- 6/6/2003 at 3:20 p.m.
              • Re: So, we need a topic...Lets try this? *PIC*
                Archer »–)› (AST002-2.msns.sm.ptd.net) -- 6/5/2003 at 11:05 p.m.
                • Re: So, we need a topic...Lets try this?
                  Olorin (host81-134-4-127.in-addr.btopenworld.com) -- 6/6/2003 at 9:28 a.m.
            • Re: So, we need a topic...Lets try this? *PIC*
              Archer »–)› (AST002-2.msns.sm.ptd.net) -- 6/5/2003 at 10:58 p.m.
              • Re: So, we need a topic...Lets try this?
                Olorin (host81-134-4-127.in-addr.btopenworld.com) -- 6/6/2003 at 9:30 a.m.
                • Re: So, we need a topic...Lets try this?
                  Seraph (adsl-66-126-230-224.dsl.sntc01.pacbell.net) -- 6/6/2003 at 8:52 p.m.
                  • Re: So, we need a topic...Lets try this? *PIC*
                    Archer »–)› (AST002-2.msns.sm.ptd.net) -- 6/8/2003 at 7:39 p.m.
                    • Yes, I totally botched whatever my point was.
                      Seraph (adsl-66-123-168-192.dsl.sntc01.pacbell.net) -- 6/8/2003 at 11:10 p.m.
                    • Re: So, we need a topic...Lets try this?
                      Olorin (host81-134-17-71.in-addr.btopenworld.com) -- 6/9/2003 at 7:05 a.m.
                      • Salvaging some sense out of this mess.
                        Seraph (adsl-66-126-229-12.dsl.sntc01.pacbell.net) -- 6/9/2003 at 5:11 p.m.
                        • Re: Salvaging some sense out of this mess.
                          Olorin (host81-134-0-26.in-addr.btopenworld.com) -- 6/9/2003 at 5:34 p.m.
                          • Re: Salvaging some sense out of this mess.
                            Seraph (adsl-66-126-229-12.dsl.sntc01.pacbell.net) -- 6/9/2003 at 6:34 p.m.
                    • Re: So, we need a topic...Lets try this?
                      Phil (static-64-65-138-250.mspcovdsl.eschelon.com) -- 6/9/2003 at 1:55 p.m.
          • Never!!! *PIC*
            Archer »–)› (AST002-2.msns.sm.ptd.net) -- 6/5/2003 at 10:51 p.m.
            • Re: Never!!!
              Olorin (host81-134-4-127.in-addr.btopenworld.com) -- 6/6/2003 at 9:34 a.m.
              • Re: Never!!!
                Phil (static-64-65-138-250.mspcovdsl.eschelon.com) -- 6/6/2003 at 3:46 p.m.
                • Re: Never!!!
                  Olorin (host81-134-4-127.in-addr.btopenworld.com) -- 6/6/2003 at 4:15 p.m.
                  • Re: Never!!!
                    Phil (static-64-65-138-250.mspcovdsl.eschelon.com) -- 6/6/2003 at 6:08 p.m.
        • *Gets here late* *PIC*
          Archer »–)› (AST002-2.msns.sm.ptd.net) -- 6/5/2003 at 8:45 p.m.
          • Re: *Gets here late*
            Seraph (adsl-66-126-230-224.dsl.sntc01.pacbell.net) -- 6/6/2003 at 9:13 p.m.
            • Heh...
              Drunken Ghol (pcp01700673pcs.kodak01.tn.comcast.net) -- 6/7/2003 at 12:29 a.m.
              • It's Called "So We Need A Topic..." *NT* *NM*
                Olorin (host81-134-113-174.in-addr.btopenworld.com) -- 6/7/2003 at 6:29 a.m.
            • Re: *Gets here late* *PIC*
              Archer »–)› (AST002-2.msns.sm.ptd.net) -- 6/8/2003 at 9:02 a.m.
              • Re: *Gets here late*
                Seraph (adsl-64-171-5-191.dsl.sntc01.pacbell.net) -- 6/8/2003 at 5:13 p.m.
                • Re: *Gets here late* *PIC*
                  Archer »–)› (AST002-2.msns.sm.ptd.net) -- 6/8/2003 at 6:46 p.m.
                  • Talking some more...and more...
                    Seraph (adsl-66-123-168-192.dsl.sntc01.pacbell.net) -- 6/8/2003 at 10:44 p.m.
                    • Re: Talking some more...and more... *PIC*
                      Archer »–)› (AST002-2.msns.sm.ptd.net) -- 6/9/2003 at 4:48 a.m.
                      • Re: Talking some more...and more...
                        Olorin (host81-134-17-71.in-addr.btopenworld.com) -- 6/9/2003 at 6:51 a.m.
                        • Re: Talking some more...and more... *PIC*
                          Archer »–)› (AST002-2.msns.sm.ptd.net) -- 6/13/2003 at 3:15 a.m.
                          • Re: Talking some more...and more...
                            Seraph (adsl-66-123-170-245.dsl.sntc01.pacbell.net) -- 6/14/2003 at 2:01 a.m.
                          • Re: Talking some more...and more...
                            SiliconDream =PN= (host-66-202-12-108.col.choiceone.net) -- 6/15/2003 at 2:56 a.m.
                            • Re: Talking some more...and more...
                              Phil (12-225-9-44.client.attbi.com) -- 6/15/2003 at 5:34 a.m.
                              • Re: Talking some more...and more...
                                SiliconDream =PN= (host-66-202-12-108.col.choiceone.net) -- 6/15/2003 at 7:37 p.m.
                                • Double post, just like old times. :-) [NT] *NM*
                                  SiliconDream =PN= (host-66-202-12-108.col.choiceone.net) -- 6/15/2003 at 7:43 p.m.
                              • Re: Talking some more...and more...
                                SiliconDream =PN= (host-66-202-12-108.col.choiceone.net) -- 6/15/2003 at 7:41 p.m.
                                • *derails the subthread*
                                  Seraph (adsl-64-171-6-162.dsl.sntc01.pacbell.net) -- 6/16/2003 at 6:36 p.m.
                                • Re: Talking some more...and more...
                                  Phil (static-64-65-138-250.mspcovdsl.eschelon.com) -- 6/16/2003 at 6:42 p.m.
                            • Re: Talking some more...and more...
                              Superfoborg (term1-24.vta.west.net) -- 6/17/2003 at 1:54 a.m.
                              • Re: Talking some more...and more...
                                SiliconDream =PN= (host-66-202-12-108.col.choiceone.net) -- 6/17/2003 at 11:28 p.m.
                                • Re: Talking some more...and more...
                                  Superfoborg (205.254.241.89) -- 6/18/2003 at 12:09 a.m.
                                • Heya Sili
                                  Iron Duke (zepher.lnk.telstra.net) -- 6/18/2003 at 6:20 p.m.
                                  • Re: Heya Sili
                                    SiliconDream =PN= (host-66-202-12-108.col.choiceone.net) -- 6/18/2003 at 10:10 p.m.
                                    • oh sure, ignore me! :( *NM*
                                      Miguel Chavez (24-90-239-158.nyc.rr.com) -- 6/19/2003 at 9:14 a.m.
                                      • Calls taken in the order they were received. :-)
                                        SiliconDream =PN= (66.202.12.108) -- 6/19/2003 at 2:17 p.m.
                                      • Calls taken in the order they were received. :-)
                                        SiliconDream =PN= (66.202.12.108) -- 6/19/2003 at 2:49 p.m.
                                        • Hmm...
                                          Miguel Chavez (24-90-239-158.nyc.rr.com) -- 6/26/2003 at 9:26 a.m.
                                          • Re: Hmm...
                                            SiliconDream =PN= (host-66-202-12-108.col.choiceone.net) -- 6/27/2003 at 7:29 a.m.
                            • SILLLLLLI!
                              Miguel Chavez (24-90-239-158.nyc.rr.com) -- 6/18/2003 at 7:17 p.m.
                      • Re: Talking some more...and more...
                        Phil (static-64-65-138-250.mspcovdsl.eschelon.com) -- 6/9/2003 at 6:11 p.m.
                        • *is in total agreement.*
                          Seraph (adsl-66-126-229-12.dsl.sntc01.pacbell.net) -- 6/9/2003 at 6:51 p.m.
                          • Re: *is in total agreement.*
                            Phil (static-64-65-138-250.mspcovdsl.eschelon.com) -- 6/9/2003 at 7:57 p.m.
                            • Re: *is in total agreement.*
                              Seraph (adsl-66-126-229-12.dsl.sntc01.pacbell.net) -- 6/9/2003 at 8:50 p.m.
                              • Re: *is in total agreement.*
                                Phil (static-64-65-138-250.mspcovdsl.eschelon.com) -- 6/10/2003 at 2:32 p.m.
                            • Re: *is in total agreement.*
                              Superfoborg (term1-29.vta.west.net) -- 6/10/2003 at 2:16 a.m.
                              • Re: *is in total agreement.*
                                Phil (static-64-65-138-250.mspcovdsl.eschelon.com) -- 6/10/2003 at 2:32 p.m.
                                • Re: *is in total agreement.*
                                  Superfoborg (ip68-6-118-241.sb.sd.cox.net) -- 6/10/2003 at 5:02 p.m.
                                  • Re: *is in total agreement.*
                                    Phil (static-64-65-138-250.mspcovdsl.eschelon.com) -- 6/10/2003 at 7:30 p.m.
                      • Re: Talking some more...and more...
                        Ilex (6fe9.yhteys.mtv3.fi) -- 6/15/2003 at 7:39 a.m.
                  • Re: *Gets here late*
                    Phil (static-64-65-138-250.mspcovdsl.eschelon.com) -- 6/9/2003 at 3:56 p.m.
                    • Bush and his politics
                      Seraph (adsl-66-126-229-12.dsl.sntc01.pacbell.net) -- 6/9/2003 at 5:24 p.m.
                      • Re: Bush and his politics
                        Phil (static-64-65-138-250.mspcovdsl.eschelon.com) -- 6/9/2003 at 6:30 p.m.
                        • Re: Bush and his politics
                          Seraph (adsl-66-126-229-12.dsl.sntc01.pacbell.net) -- 6/9/2003 at 6:44 p.m.
                          • Re: Bush and his politics
                            Phil (static-64-65-138-250.mspcovdsl.eschelon.com) -- 6/9/2003 at 7:40 p.m.
                            • Re: Bush and his politics
                              Seraph (adsl-66-126-229-12.dsl.sntc01.pacbell.net) -- 6/9/2003 at 8:43 p.m.
                              • Re: Bush and his politics
                                Phil (static-64-65-138-250.mspcovdsl.eschelon.com) -- 6/10/2003 at 2:32 p.m.
                                • Re: Bush and his politics
                                  Superfoborg (term2-23.vta.west.net) -- 6/11/2003 at 1:06 a.m.
                                  • Re: Bush and his politics
                                    Phil (static-64-65-138-250.mspcovdsl.eschelon.com) -- 6/11/2003 at 7:56 p.m.
                                    • Re: Bush and his politics
                                      Superfoborg (term1-16.vta.west.net) -- 6/12/2003 at 12:51 a.m.
                                      • Re: Bush and his politics
                                        Phil (static-64-65-138-250.mspcovdsl.eschelon.com) -- 6/12/2003 at 5:22 p.m.
                                        • Re: Bush and his politics
                                          Superfoborg (term1-12.vta.west.net) -- 6/13/2003 at 12:53 a.m.
                                          • Re: Bush and his politics
                                            Phil (static-64-65-138-250.mspcovdsl.eschelon.com) -- 6/13/2003 at 6:50 p.m.
                                            • Re: Bush and his politics
                                              Superfoborg (ip68-6-118-241.sb.sd.cox.net) -- 6/13/2003 at 8:59 p.m.
                                              • Re: Bush and his politics
                                                Phil (12-225-9-44.client.attbi.com) -- 6/14/2003 at 4:47 a.m.
                                                • Re: Bush and his politics
                                                  Superfoborg (term1-24.vta.west.net) -- 6/17/2003 at 1:50 a.m.
                                                  • Re: Bush and his politics
                                                    Phil (static-64-65-138-250.mspcovdsl.eschelon.com) -- 6/17/2003 at 12:37 p.m.
                              • Re: Bush and his politics
                                Martel (lns-p19-9-213-228-44-169.adsl.proxad.net) -- 6/14/2003 at 9:32 a.m.
  • Re: hey
    Doom (207.239.12.200) -- 5/27/2003 at 11:38 a.m.

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