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A New Grand Unified Theory

Posted By: Superfoborg (
Date: 10/16/2006 at 1:33 a.m.

In Response To: OK, lets speculate. (Romendacil)

: OK, lets speculate again on some things.

: Firstly, I would like to finally know; Is the cykle 1000
: years? I mean 1000 years light, then comes leveler,
: 1000 years dark, hero comes, kills leveler, 1000 years
: light, hero returns as leveler, 1000 years dark and so
: on..
: Or is it diffurent?

Originally (as in, before Myth was released, when Jason Jones was talking about it in an interview), the *entire* cycle was 1000 years - 500 light, 500 dark. (Then again, Balor was named Ashfear back then, so some things change). According to that cycle, Connacht defeated the Myrkridia 1000 years ago, disappeared, then Balor started showing up at least 300 years ago to turn the Myrmidons, (and probably on a lesser scale even earlier than that), and the shit really started to hit the fan at the time of TFL, when the comet rose in the sky, Tharsis erupted, and Alric killed Balor, ushering in the new Age of Light. For ease of use I'm going to call this theory the "Short Cycle".

By the time Myth 2 was out and we were all speculating on it, it had somehow become "common knowledge" around here that the cycle was 1000 light, 1000 dark, 2000 total. (I'm going to call that the "Long Cycle"). But the only thing I can think of that seems to concretely claim this is the " least not for another 940 years" bit from the end of the Myth 2 epilogue. However, if that were the case, then the Age of Light ushered in by Connacht 1000 years ago would just be ending at the time of TFL, which means that this era was - as you said - supposed to be Dark, thus it was *Alric* who broke the cycle, not Soulblighter, as that very same Myth II epilogue claims.

This makes me now inclined to think that the " least not for another 940 years" bit means that, if in 940 years no dark lord has risen to power and nearly destroyed the world... then the cycle is broken. Because according to the short cycle theory (at least, how it seems to have played out between Connacht and Alric's days), the Leveller doesn't just show up all of a sudden and BAM it's a dark age. He shows up, starts pulling strings, doing bad things, amassing armies, THEN attacks in force, and right as he's about to destroy the world, right on time... is defeated. So it's not like we can just wait 440 years to see if the Leveller shows up, because in 440 years he'll still be a small-time nobody just beginning his evil plans. We'll have to wait the whole 940 to see if there's another Great War or not, cause those only happen every 1000 years.

Now, GURPS and Myth III explicitly state that the long cycle theory is correct. However, GURPS has shown many many faults in the past (despite my previous defense of it), and Myth III was based on research that Scott Campbell did from GURPS and from this very website, so errors in those places would carry over into Myth III. Given all the above, I'm inclined to think that the cycle really is short, and that GURPS, Myth III, and many of my own previous and popular theories were completely wrong.

: What will happen to the myth wold now? Any thoughts on
: that? What will happen now that the cycle is
: broken..because I think It IS broken. Will things be
: turned upside down? Will light rule forever? Or will
: the monsters still return.

Well, if it's a short cycle, then the Light won on schedule, Soulblighter was an anomaly, and the cycle may be broken (in which case the Leveller may not return, but it might not be all sunshine and roses for the Light either - see next paragraph). But we can't be sure of that until 940 years from Myth II.

If it's a long cycle, then it's supposed to be a Dark Era, and the brief 60 years of peace was an anomaly. Alric is still around and quite powerful so the Light might hang on for a bit, but consider: Soulblighter has taught many lesser mages (like Baron Kildaer) the art of necromancy, so making undead is no longer an esoteric and difficult ritual, and many petty warlords might be doing it. On top of that, the Myrkridia are loose on the world again and may begin breeding, which would be a very bad thing. And in the face of these possible threats, the Light has only one city left: the ruins of Muirthemne. If you could call that a city. That's worse than even Balor left the world. So it's looking like this will be a very Dark age, as it's supposed to be by the Long Cycle theory.

: 1) When was Mazzarin killed?
: I only know that it happened in the wind age, but when
: exactly? Oh...and..I seem not to know even in what
: order do the ages come..please clear that point for
: me.

We don't know when in the Wind Age Mazzarin died.

As for the ages, according to GURPS, the order goes:

Axe Age - all of prehistory.
Age of Reason - Tireces' reign and legacy
Wind Age - Moagim's reign
Wolf Age a.k.a. Age of Light - Connacht's legacy
Sword Age - tentative name for the present age

However, that all assumes a long cycle, which is spurious, so lets ignore GURPS and go with game texts.

According to those, the "Age of Light", was the age in which Connacht ruled, and he is also called the "hero of the Wind Age", although some rather bad things were said to have happened then, so it may be as M3 portrays it, that the Wind Age was the age that Connacht saved the world from, not the age he ushered in.

The "Age of Reason" was when Tireces ruled.

It seems certain that the Wolf Age is most recent, by this quote:

One hundred ten years ago, during the Wolf Age, Muirthemne was sacked, burned and all but buried under a mountain of rock and sand by Balor and the Fallen Lords.
-Myth II, Level 16, "The Ibis Crown"

All we know of The Axe Age is that it is when the Free Cities of the North were settled, making it seem a long long time ago:

"The wolves of The Ermine have been a menace to the people of the Free Cities of the North... since the area was settled in the Axe Age."
-Wolf Flavor Text, Myth II

The Sword Age for some reason was long thought (here) to be the current age, during which TFL takes place - either the new age just beginning with the Great War, or the age ending with the Great War. But the only quote about it seems to be this:

Long enemies of the civilized nations, the truce which brought the fir'Bolg and their famed bowmen into the Light was forged by ou'Kahn the Great King and Caliban during the Sword Age.
-Archer Flavor Text, Myth TFL

Since the fir'Bolg were thought to be recent allies, I can see why this would make us think that the Sword Age was recent. However, given this flavor text...

Of all the avatara in the Four Ages there is no doubt that Mazzarin was the most powerful and his death the most salient victory of the Dark during the Wind Age.
-Avatara Flavor Text, Myth TFL seems that there are only four known or named Ages, and since we have six names for ages (Axe, Sword, Wind, Wolf, Reason, and Light), and two of those are already identified as each other (Age of Light = Wolf Age), that two others must also be synonymous, giving us four ages in total.

Given that the ages seem to be named from the Norse poem "Voluspa", which reads in part "an axe-age, a sword-age / shields will be cloven / a wind-age, a wolf-age / before the world's ruin", I'm going to propose that the named Ages progress in that order: Axe, Sword, Wind, Wolf.

HOWEVER, given the following bit from the Myth II epilogue, I'm going to argue that the named ages do not correspond to particular periods of light or dark, but rather, to the entire 1000 years encompassing both:

"The Leveler was never killed. He was immobilized by sorcery, beheaded and burned at the stake in the Second Era. A thousand years later he was drawn and quartered on the plains before Ileum, the tireless horses dragging the pieces of his lifeless body to the four corners of the world. Again in the Fourth Era his body was destroyed by fire, his ashes mixed with salt and buried under the Mountains of Kor. Balor, Moagim and all those before them wore the Mantle of The Leveler. "
-Myth II Epilogue

So according to this theory (short cycle, Voluspa order):

4000 years before the end of TFL, an unknown Leveller was killed somehow by an unknown hero (maybe? or the world was just created from scratch right then?), and thus began the Axe Age or First Era. Sometime during that era, the Free Cities of the North were settled.

Then, a thousand years later, 3000 years before the end of TFL, after the previous hero had turned to the Dark and become the new Leveller, another hero (Caliban?) had him "immobilized by sorcery, beheaded and burned at the stake", ushering in the Sword Age or Second Era. Sometime during that era, the humans and fir'Bolg forged a truce.

Then, a thousand years later, 2000 years before the end of TFL, after the previous hero had turned to the Dark and become the new Leveller, Tireces had him "drawn and quartered on the plains before Ileum, the tireless horses dragging the pieces of his lifeless body to the four corners of the world", ushering in the Wind Age or Third Era, the Light portion of which was called the Age of Reason. Sometime during this era, the Tain was forged, Mazzarin was killed by Bahl'al, and Tireces became Moagim and unleashed the Myrkridia upon the world.

Then, a thousand years later, 1000 years before the end of TFL, after Tireces had turned to the Dark and become the new Leveller Moagim, Connacht killed him and had "his body [...] destroyed by fire, his ashes mixed with salt and buried under the Mountains of Kor", ushering in the Wolf Age or Fourth Era, the Light portion of which was called the Age of Light.

Connacht eventually became the new Leveller some 500 years ago, and slowly began to amass his evil army, gathering the Fallen Lords to himself, turning the Myrmidons to the Dark, raising an army of the undead, before finally destroying Muirthemne, pouring into the West, and nearly destroying the world before being defeated by Alric, ending the Fourth Era and beginning a new period of time, one that has yet to be named properly.

Yes sir, I think I like it.

: 2)Then: When did Cath Bruig fall..I mean, when did
: Muirthemne fall, how long has it been since HG`s
: became Jmen?

Fifty years before TFL; 110 years before Myth II.

: 3)BahlŽ old is he? Was he ever the leveler? Or is
: he just a powerful guy who destroyed the land? Was he
: the first to discover the dream of unlive? That would
: make him the second biggest villain besides the
: leveler in Myth.

He doesn't seem to have ever been the Leveller, since the Leveller was always killed in really nasty ways that wouldn't leave much of a body behind. We don't know if he ever DID find the Dream of Unlife for certain, and even if he did, we don't know if he was the first or not.

: 4)When was the time when Trows ruled? When was the time
: they destroyed the ogres? Before all ages? Before men
: and dwarves even came to be?

According to the "Tales from Myth TFL" comic (which is Bungie canon material), the Trow ruled from time immemorial, being the first race, and they seem to have had their own dealings with the Leveller (and kicked his ass repeatedly). For detailed info, see the comic itself:

: Hoping that I do not bother you too much, and to clear
: out the gaps of my knowledge in myth history.

No problem. In fact, I'm quite glad you asked these questions... it got me on by butt doing research again, and I think I've put together a nice new theory that makes all the little bits of nonsense stuff from Myth and Myth II actually make sense, without it seeming like Bungie changed things mid-development. It means we have to reject a lot of GURPS and Myth III, but I'm not too fond of either of them anyway.

I've thrown together a little graphic to illustrate this new theory:

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