HBOHBO Forum
glyphstrip  
Halo.bungie.org
glyphstrip
Frequently Asked Forum Questions
 Search the HBO News Archives

Any All Exact 
Search the Halo Updates DBs

BWU Halo Halo2 
Search Older Posts on This Forum:
Posts on Current Forum | Archived Posts

View Thread Reply Return to Index Set Prefs Previous Next
Re: Unsung Hero of the Halo Franchise
By:Grizzlei
Date: 10/4/15 3:30 pm
In Response To: Re: Unsung Hero of the Halo Franchise (General Vagueness)

: I never minded the blank slate character, and actually it bothers me that
: everyone seems to be getting rid of them. I don't like the idea that a
: certain character archetype is bad, even if that archetype is mainly
: defined by what it lacks. Not only that but a game is about the only place
: a blank slate character can work, and not only that but work to great
: effect. What blank slates do we have left in larger games? Even Gordon
: Freeman has a bit of backstory and ostensibly has a personality now. Why
: can't we have some blank slate characters in things other than little
: indie games?

I'm thinking that audiences are maturing and expecting more. They don't want to spend $60 on a game starring a nameless, speechless, and emotionless lead that they themselves can't have explicit agency over with games like Mass Effect. Who wants to spend money on a story with a character that isn't fully realized? I personally have never bought into the sense of immersion that Bungie seems to have wanted for the Master Chief. I can't imagine myself doing these things because I'll never be a gargantuan supersoldier. I don't want the Master Chief to be me. Otherwise I'd be sitting in orbit aboard a starship, press a single button, and nuke a Halo ring. When I buy a $60 game I honestly expect some care put into the person you're putting front and center in your cover.

Destiny soured me completely to the concept of a blank slate and I'm not too surprised that this let down came from Bungie. Our Guardians were unfulfilled entities in a universe that was supposed to be absolutely rich with amazing stories. Not only did we barely get that in the game's narrative itself, having to rely on some trading cards to make sense of the story, but we were given nothing to imagine how our Guardians felt overcoming these tremendous foes. Your guess is honestly as good as mine as to what my very own Guardian's personality, emotions, aspirations, fears, etc. are like. That's why I gave up on Destiny almost immediately after it came out. I buy games first and foremost to experience a rich new universe or an exciting new entry in an established franchise. Touting Destiny as exactly that then not even caring to put time or energy into fleshing the Guardians out felt like a waste of time.

It can be done right, don't get me wrong, but sometimes a blank slate avatar just seems like a poor cop out for not wanting to fully realize them and bring your character to life. Headcanon is great but it doesn't leave you with the same since of fulfillment that something imbedded in the game can provide. When you decide to make these characters an avatar but don't offer players the tools to make them their own outside of appearance and gameplay style that doesn't sit well with me. Role playing only goes so far in a universe where you expect your character to have more of an impact outside of shooting a gun, swinging a sword, or casting a spell.

: I would also rather have a blank slate than the cartoonishly evil origin
: story we got from Nylund. Abducting little kids, replacing them with
: clones that will die soon, training the kids in combat, subjecting them to
: experimental procedures that kill a bunch of them and make others unable
: to have a normal life... we're used to overlooking it but that's on the
: level of a bad comic book villain. The fact a lot of things established in
: The Fall of Reach were contradicted by other authors suggests... well you
: can probably see where that's going. I still wonder if giving the
: Spartan-IIIs a slightly different origin was a response to feedback on the
: S-IIs. I will say I don't particularly blame him beyond the existence of
: certain concepts-- the whole thing was stressful, he had to write it in 7
: weeks, it was his first entry into the universe, and Bungie, who came up
: with the universe, were too busy to talk to him.

I don't see how it's cartoonishly evil when the science behind it, however monsterous it may be, appears to be quite solid and the kidnapping of young children to become soldiers sadly has precedent even today. The SPARTAN-II's are a perfect example of how an empire will do whatever it can to maintain a grasp on what they believe is only theirs. That means using their subjects, often those on the fringes of society such as in the Outer Colonies, to carry out violence against their own people. New canon has only added to the politics and emotions behind the SPARTAN-II's coming to existence such as the brief mentions of the "Carver Findings."

SPARTAN-III's being recruited and volunteering for service, instead of kidnapped and conscripted, comes out of the circumstances the UNSC found itself in with countless millions of orphaned children from the war. They had neither the resources nor the will to bother with nighttime kidnappings when they could easily scrounge up some blood thirsty kids withering away on the streets of the colonies. CINCONI knew what she did with the Two's was wrong, at least in hindsight, and I'm sure Colonel Ackerson didn't want to get his hands dirty like Dr. Halsey had. The Human-Covenant War served as the Three's reason for being and also it's saving grace not having to deal with kidnapped six year olds.

I don't think fan feedback had anything to do with how the SPARTAN-III's came to be. Even back then the vast majority of fans supported the Two's mere existence. Do we debate endlessly about the morality of these programs? Absolutely and we should continue to do so. It's a good topic to discuss concerning the universe's most controversial elements and how we can tie them into the real world. Even the most ardently anti-Halsey fans, however, myself included, will admit without hesitation that if Humanity not had Spartans they would have gone extinct long before we had the chance to screw around on a Halo ring.


Messages In This Thread

Unsung Hero of the Halo FranchiseGrizzlei10/2/15 9:15 pm
     Re: Unsung Hero of the Halo Franchisezofinda10/2/15 9:27 pm
     Re: Unsung Hero of the Halo FranchiseMetalingus62710/2/15 10:04 pm
     Listen to the Podcast Eric Suggestsmacgyver1010/2/15 10:15 pm
           Re: This cave is not...what I was toldmelee10/3/15 9:19 am
           Re: Listen to the Podcast Eric SuggestsTuckerscreator10/5/15 3:32 pm
                 Re: Listen to the Podcast Eric SuggestsArchilen10/6/15 5:53 am
     Bungie being complete dicks...scarab10/3/15 3:52 am
           Indeed.car1510/3/15 3:55 pm
           Wow.Quirel10/4/15 1:01 am
                 Re: Wow.car1510/4/15 2:09 am
                 Re: Wow.scarab10/4/15 9:54 am
                       Re: Wow.Quirel10/6/15 2:25 pm
                 Re: Wow.Masterz133710/4/15 11:19 am
                       Re: Wow.Quirel10/6/15 2:10 pm
                 Re: Wow.Cody Miller10/5/15 12:48 pm
     Re: Unsung Hero of the Halo FranchiseGeneral Vagueness10/4/15 1:53 pm
           Re: Unsung Hero of the Halo FranchiseGeneral Vagueness10/4/15 1:55 pm
           Re: Unsung Hero of the Halo FranchiseThe BS Police10/4/15 2:54 pm
                 Re: Unsung Hero of the Halo FranchisecheapLEY10/4/15 3:10 pm
                       Re: Unsung Hero of the Halo Franchisecar1510/4/15 5:58 pm
                             Re: Unsung Hero of the Halo FranchisecheapLEY10/4/15 6:20 pm
                                   Re: Unsung Hero of the Halo Franchisecar1510/4/15 8:50 pm
                                         Re: Unsung Hero of the Halo Franchisezofinda10/4/15 9:11 pm
                                         100% Agreedmacgyver1010/4/15 9:21 pm
                                         YepGrizzlei10/4/15 9:45 pm
                                   Re: Unsung Hero of the Halo FranchiseCody Miller10/5/15 1:01 pm
                       Re: Unsung Hero of the Halo FranchiseCody Miller10/5/15 12:58 pm
                 Re: Unsung Hero of the Halo FranchiseCody Miller10/5/15 12:55 pm
                 Re: Unsung Hero of the Halo FranchiseGeneral Vagueness10/5/15 2:52 pm
                 Re: Unsung Hero of the Halo FranchiseQuirel10/6/15 2:09 pm
                       Re: Unsung Hero of the Halo Franchisedavidfuchs10/6/15 3:01 pm
           Re: Unsung Hero of the Halo FranchiseGrizzlei10/4/15 3:30 pm
                 I like and agree with this too! *NM*macgyver1010/4/15 9:22 pm
                 Re: Unsung Hero of the Halo FranchiseMorhek10/5/15 2:11 am
                       Re: Unsung Hero of the Halo FranchiseGrizzlei10/5/15 3:25 am
                             Re: Unsung Hero of the Halo FranchiseMorhek10/5/15 5:13 am
                                   Re: Unsung Hero of the Halo FranchiseGrizzlei10/5/15 5:46 am
                                         Re: Unsung Hero of the Halo FranchiseFree Weights10/5/15 2:17 pm
                                               Re: Unsung Hero of the Halo FranchiseGeneral Vagueness10/5/15 4:17 pm
                                                     Re: Unsung Hero of the Halo FranchiseGrizzlei10/5/15 4:24 pm
                                                           Re: Unsung Hero of the Halo FranchiseGeneral Vagueness10/5/15 4:43 pm
                                                                 Re: Unsung Hero of the Halo FranchiseGrizzlei10/5/15 4:48 pm
                                                     Re: Unsung Hero of the Halo FranchiseMacGyver1010/5/15 4:30 pm
                                                           Re: Unsung Hero of the Halo FranchiseGeneral Vagueness10/5/15 5:10 pm
                                                     Re: Unsung Hero of the Halo FranchiseFree Weights10/6/15 4:02 pm
                             Isn't that the point?scarab10/5/15 12:26 pm
                                   Re: Isn't that the point?iamaquestionmark10/5/15 1:10 pm
                                         Re: Isn't that the point?kidtsunami10/5/15 1:37 pm
                                               Re: Isn't that the point?iamaquestionmark10/5/15 3:06 pm
                                               Re: Isn't that the point?General Vagueness10/5/15 4:10 pm
                                                     Re: Isn't that the point?Grizzlei10/5/15 4:20 pm
                                         Re: Isn't that the point?Grizzlei10/5/15 4:12 pm
                                         Re: Isn't that the point?Morhek10/5/15 7:16 pm
                                               Re: Isn't that the point?General Vagueness10/5/15 10:57 pm
                                   Re: Isn't that the point?Grizzlei10/5/15 4:07 pm
                                         Re: Isn't that the point?scarab10/6/15 3:49 pm
                                               Re: Isn't that the point?Grizzlei10/6/15 4:12 pm
                                                     Re: Isn't that the point?scarab10/6/15 4:50 pm
                                                           Re: Isn't that the point?Grizzlei10/6/15 5:03 pm
                                                                 Re: Isn't that the point?zofinda10/6/15 8:14 pm
                                                                       Re: Isn't that the point?Grizzlei10/6/15 8:24 pm
                                                                             Re: Isn't that the point?zofinda10/6/15 8:30 pm
                                                                                   Re: Isn't that the point?Grizzlei10/6/15 8:35 pm
                                                                                         Re: Isn't that the point?zofinda10/6/15 8:40 pm
                                                                 Did you read the books after the game?scarab10/7/15 3:26 pm
                                                                       Re: Did you read the books after the game?Grizzlei10/7/15 3:34 pm
                                                                             I prefer to get that from the other characters.scarab10/7/15 4:13 pm
                                         Re: Isn't that the point?Quirel10/6/15 5:15 pm
                             Re: Unsung Hero of the Halo FranchiseGeneral Vagueness10/5/15 3:46 pm
                 Re: Unsung Hero of the Halo FranchiseGeneral Vagueness10/5/15 3:36 pm
                 Re: Unsung Hero of the Halo FranchiseTuckerscreator10/5/15 3:46 pm
           I was surprised when I found out my backstoryscarab10/5/15 7:24 am
     Re: Unsung Hero of the Halo FranchiseArchilen10/5/15 7:45 am
           Yeh, it doesn't seem to be one u can pin on Bungie *NM*scarab10/5/15 12:16 pm
           Re: Unsung Hero of the Halo FranchiseTuckerscreator10/5/15 3:27 pm
     Checks HBO. Walks back out revolving door.Leviathan10/7/15 2:19 pm
           So you dropped in in to tell us we suck?scarab10/7/15 2:28 pm
                 That was not my intent.Leviathan10/7/15 2:40 pm
                       Re: That was not my intent.Leviathan10/7/15 2:44 pm
                       Bullshit Levi - nothing needed twistingscarab10/7/15 2:44 pm
                             Re: Bullshit Levi - nothing needed twistingQuirel10/7/15 2:50 pm
                                   you didn't read his post as passive agressive?scarab10/7/15 3:06 pm
                                         Re: you didn't read his post as passive agressive?Grizzlei10/7/15 3:21 pm
                                               amen to that *NM*kidtsunami10/7/15 3:33 pm
                                               Let's fix this...ChrisTheeCrappy10/7/15 3:37 pm
                                                     Re: Let's fix this...Grizzlei10/7/15 3:51 pm
                                                           Re: Let's fix this...ChrisTheeCrappy10/7/15 3:56 pm
                                               Prior to his post where was the angst between us? *NM*scarab10/7/15 3:49 pm
                                         Re: you didn't read his post as passive agressive?uberfoop10/7/15 3:22 pm
                                               I thought levi was vilifying usscarab10/7/15 4:00 pm
                                                     Re: I thought levi was vilifying usLeviathan10/7/15 4:37 pm
                                                     Re: I thought levi was vilifying usGeneral Vagueness10/7/15 6:45 pm
                                                           Yeh, I know, I bitscarab10/8/15 2:52 pm
                                                                 Re: Yeh, I know, I bitGeneral Vagueness10/8/15 4:41 pm
                                         Re: you didn't read his post as passive agressive?General Vagueness10/7/15 3:30 pm
                                         The Shadow of my Intent.Leviathan10/7/15 3:54 pm
                                               Re: The Shadow of my Intent.General Vagueness10/7/15 6:37 pm
                                                     Re: The Shadow of my Intent.Leviathan10/7/15 7:42 pm
                                         Re: you didn't read his post as passive agressive?Quirel10/7/15 3:54 pm
                                               Re: you didn't read his post as passive agressive?Leviathan10/7/15 4:07 pm
                                               Re: you didn't read his post as passive agressive?thebruce010/8/15 9:44 am
                             Seriously?cheapLEY10/7/15 10:46 pm
           +1 *NM*Arithmomaniac10/7/15 2:57 pm
           +2 *NM*munky-05810/7/15 4:21 pm
           Why not focus on the positive discussions?The BS Police10/7/15 4:32 pm
                 Sometimes, bad behavior needs to be called outkidtsunami10/7/15 5:19 pm
           Switches out revolving door for welcome matMacGyver1010/7/15 4:51 pm
                 Appreciation and Apologies.*long-ass post*Leviathan10/7/15 8:02 pm
                       Re: Appreciation and Apologies.*long-ass post*macgyver1010/7/15 10:45 pm
                       Well, safe travels and such....robofin11710/7/15 11:05 pm
                       Hope it's not a permanent good-byekidtsunami10/8/15 9:56 am
                             Re: Levi...zofinda10/8/15 10:17 pm
                                   hehe, would be fun to have an HBO Hall Of Fame *NM*kidtsunami10/9/15 8:10 am
                       I agree Levi, Screw that Scarab douche!munky-05810/10/15 2:43 pm
                             Re: I agree Levi, Screw that Scarab douche!General Vagueness10/10/15 8:09 pm
                                   Once more, with feeling...Leviathan10/11/15 1:28 pm
                                         Re: Once more, with feeling...General Vagueness10/12/15 1:07 pm
                                               HBO HaikuAfroRyan10/12/15 1:57 pm
                                               Twice more, with even MORE feeling... :)Leviathan10/12/15 5:17 pm
                                                     Re: Twice more, with even MORE feeling... :)General Vagueness10/12/15 6:56 pm
                                                     Re: Twice more, with even MORE feeling... :)uberfoop10/12/15 7:06 pm
                                                           Re: Twice more, with even MORE feeling... :)Leviathan10/12/15 7:25 pm
                                                                 Yes, they are beautifulscarab10/13/15 1:13 pm
                                                                       Re: Yes, they are beautifulLeviathan10/13/15 1:51 pm
                                                     Hey Levi, I think this might help.robofin11710/13/15 2:14 am
                                                           Re: Hey Levi, I think this might help.Leviathan10/13/15 2:50 am
           FORGEpete_the_duck10/7/15 7:42 pm
                 ..and lack of an edit button *NM*pete_the_duck10/7/15 7:44 pm
                       I like the lack of an edit button *NM*macgyver1010/7/15 10:49 pm
                 Re: FORGELeviathan10/7/15 7:45 pm
           hey who took my ashtray? *NM*Bounce-A-Gon10/7/15 8:21 pm

Sign up to post.

You will only be able to post to the forum if you first create a user profile.
If, however, you already have a user profile, please follow the "Set Preferences" link on the main index page and enter your user name to log in to post.